If you watch the news you're aware of the events taking place in the middle east reguarding violent protests against anti-Muslim danish Cartoons. Most people will tell you that violence is obviously not the answer, but the issue at hand here is... Do you think that the rights of free speech should be curbed so it does not offend a religion?

This post has been edited by jayi12-15psi: Feb 8, 2006 - 5:23 PM

It's kinda a silly question. Of course, we as Americans are in favor of free speech. Those who live in the Middle East obviously have a different opinion. That opinion being that their religious laws are more important than political rights.

I'm sure there are people here that would be offended if there was offensive pictures of Jesus published, and I'm sure most people will favor free speech. I would also think that other people would think that freedom of speech goes to far sometime. There's already laws that inhibit total free speech, maybe we should include religious offenses in these laws in order to stop violence in countries where religious laws are more important than political rights.

we're also not all Americans.

i went for religious ideals on this specific topic.


Freedom Of Speech is not a right without responsibility.

The cartoons are clearly offensive attacks on the faith of all Muslims and it is not surprising that people are upset \\


Heres a link to the cartoons - scroll about halfway down

http://www.brusselsjournal.com/node/698
boos teezee

This post has been edited by BlackCelicaGT94: Feb 8, 2006 - 7:33 PM

Freedom of speech is a natural right you are born with. Religion is something you aquire. Responsibility comes with BOTH however the freedom of speech lets you say "praise god" without being thrown in jail.

boos teezee[/quote] lol not nice whered u pick that up

in regards to whats going on with the cartoons and this particular question- freedom of speech trumps any attempt to have religious overtones silence it, in my opinion- In the middle east, you see in their media plenty of extreme defamatory material against you name it (jewish people and amricans come to the top of my mind)- yet the rest of the world is supposed to quelch anything that these people find offensive? i dont think so... You don't see americans buring Afgani or North korean flags in the streets over negative press they roll out... In my opinion, a lot of middle eastern "values" are just too ancient to function within our western culture. The cartoon of Allah having his eyes coverd with a black line, and of the two women fully covered except for their eyes is a perfect example of this to me. I think the cartoon makes a great point in that women certainly have no equallity when it comes to their society and how the the koran dictates that- and they see it as this huge insult to their culture because 'the book says so", even though most of the world sees differently... The outrage that has come of this, i find unwarranted... I do think, however, that the illustration of Allah's turbin resembling a bomb was in VERY bad taste, but honestly, it is most certainly not enough to justify people buring down embassies and so on and so forth...

There is no need for all that violence they should just grow up those cartoons were for humour and freedom of speech. Lots of people think those cartoons are quite funny.

Its not even a close call: Freedom of speech. Freedom of speech is closely tied to the freedom to worship and both are jeopardized by this religious fanatism. Those people engaging in violence are criminals - plain and simple. Words, writings and cartoons cannot impede a true believer's convictions. Sure, they may be highly insulted by the things that were printed, but how can anyone believe that gives them the right to blow somebody up? The only alternative is to outlaw the speech and punish any offenders. We all know how well that works (Communist China, Hitler era Germany, etc.)

I think these guys need a beer and a lay to relax followed by a life long prison cell to reflect on their crimes while they rot away.

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We also need to not shove it in peoples faces about freedom of speech. Just as we have the right to not believe a particular religoin, they have the right to believe it. And if we're talking about Muslims here, remember that the terorist are extreemist. Their are these extreemist in every religion, and shouldn't be confused with most others or the same religion.

Freedom of speech sometimes gos to far, like on here if this topic
makes it till morning I will be amazed. I think it is a good topic, but
I read somewhere religious topics usually get deleted. Lots of people
have strong ideals which usually starts bickering then boom, delete
or lock. good luck with this one.

Well, I hope it dosen't get deleted. I think things like this are important, it's very relative with alot of things going on with our civil rights such as the recent wire tapping and patriot acts. At what point should a government deny civil rights because they cause more harm than good? I can clearly understand the offenses in those cartoons, but it's a difficult task finding the perfect balance. I hope this topic stays open, I wasn't looking to start something to offend religions. Personally, I think ultra-liberals sometimes lose sight of the fact that certain rights shouldn't be abused, and to push the envelope sometimes causes things as severe as death.

The constitution is 200 and somthing years old. They didn't have computers,
do we still need representitives? The government is inherently Fu--edup.
The people can decide anything nowadays. I voted with the major minority.

Don't dis me and I won't dis you. Kinda the life I try and lead.
I am not religious but know the difference between right and wrong.
Kinda like the do unto others. No, I think persocuting a whole religion
for the things a few have done is BS.

This post has been edited by 97lestyousay: Feb 9, 2006 - 12:16 AM

I wasn't trying to persecute a whole religion and I believe that most people realize that every religion has extremists. I also believe that these extremists are being widely publicised in the muslim world as opposed to other religious extremists. As a collective religion, they're getting a bad name because it's trendy to feel hate for the Muslim world as Americans, and these acts of violence give people the little reason to justify how some Americans want to feel. I've of course seen these cartoons and they are offensive, but here are several cartoons offensive to Jews printed in Arab news papers.

http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/category/...uslim_cartoons/

(scroll down a bit)

I think they're talking these cartoons way to seriously and these acts of violence are unaccepable, but should the creator of these cartoons be responsible for a portion of the violence?

This post has been edited by jayi12-15psi: Feb 9, 2006 - 1:10 AM

[quote name='nader' date='Feb 8, 2006 - 6:13 PM' post='391000']
boos teezee[/quote] lol not nice whered u pick that up
[/quote]


i know some arabic :-) ;-)

what does that mean? for the rest of us who don't speak arabic.

boos teezee = kiss my A$$

Jayi12 - ur a Gawwad

gawwad = pimp

ok im off to bed yall

Assalamu alaikum
Peace be upon you

This post has been edited by BlackCelicaGT94: Feb 9, 2006 - 1:18 AM

>


Ur confused I'm on ur side. 4 votes.

This post has been edited by 97lestyousay: Feb 9, 2006 - 1:19 AM

this forum is not for these kinds of discussions, it only leads to chaos

well, now that I look at it, this conversation has many sides, I tried to stay impartial to begin with but I suck at not speaking my piece.

>

Agreed!!

I know it's taboo, but I think it's ok as long as we don't start making attacks on religion or political agenda.

Let's just keep it reasonable, we're all adults and we should be able to have inteligent conversation on such matters. If not, lock it, no big deal.

as long as you guys can DEBATE the topic, without it turning into a pissing war, it'll stay open

>

I think you kinda have it backwards. The liberals are the ones fighting for your liberties more than anybody else.

>
lol, that's what they want you to think. I'm very anti-American at this point in my life. Any remember "Animal Farm?" Whose to say the only time something like that would happen is when it's a Communist system? It just takes longer for Napolian and Snowball to take power. Communism is the greatest thing in the world in theory. But like all systems of government, it has it's flaws. Like the wicked coming to power and controlling. You have to give America credit for making it as long as it has.

This post has been edited by Bigmeanbulldog55: Feb 9, 2006 - 9:49 AM

Communism fails because its very anti-human.

>

No, I fully understand that the liberals fight for our liberties, but what I'm asking is, at what point do we have more liberties than our society can handle? Freedom of speech is great unless you're walking up to random people on the street and telling them "your baby was just run over by a dump truck."(if it's a lie) Freedom of speech is great until a simple cartoon is enough to cause death.

This post has been edited by jayi12-15psi: Feb 9, 2006 - 12:13 PM

There are people who take it a little to literally. During WWI & II you really couldnt speak out against the government and protest to stop drafting and joining the army. And I agree that its pretty horrible that there are people who would say stuff like that. But there also comes a point in time where anything anybody says its going to offend someone, and the fact of the matter is that people gotta get over it. If you sit and get offended by such things as a cartoon, then you really need to open a window and chill out. Its a fuggin cartoon - its the whole society over there that takes religion way to seriously and to the extreme. IMO religion is a FAR worse culprit of causing deaths than free speech.

I agree with you about religion being a worse culprit than freedom of speech when it comes to death. Is it worth doing something as extreme as possibly going to war with the muslim community because they can't take a joke?

If we draw Muhammed, they attack, we retaliate it becomes war.

Granted they shouldn't resort to violence everytime they're offended, but we have so few ways to deal with the situation if they start using violence. We know muslim extremist react with violence, should we simply try to not offend in the first place? I understand offending someone is inevitable this day in age, but maybe conflict could be avoided by being a little more PC(even though I hate being PC)?