hey guys, was trying to get my thoughts together for when i get the NT2 back. I believe ive got the necessities out of the way, and i will list what i have, please feel free to add anything i may need later or forgotten.

i plan on dyno tuning it very soon after reciveing it so i may consider pushing the dyno date back if i add water/meth soon enough.

I have:
4th gen 3sgte

Emanage blue EMS
Areomotive FPR
Koyo racing radiator
550cc injectors (stock should be enough?)
AIR/garett t3/t4 turbo
tial 38 wastegate
3inch exhaust from turbo back (mandrel bent)
turbo xs manual boost controller
turbo xs RFL BOV RICE?!
Appropriate gauges...boost,oil temp, AEM wideband
stage 2 clutch (s54 tranny)

power goals: 320-350 (i know i know, i need a mr2 tranny)
whp before swap:266/255tq@ 15psi on ct20b (stock boost level)

hopefully will be boosting 15-18 lbs w/ new turbo setup hopefully the intake manifold will hold up (crack repaired) and hopefully i shouldnt have any boost issues with the w/g placement


tips? suggestions?
I appreciate all your imput! (no flame please!)

get the WI asap.
its good stuff.

just FYI, the emanage is a piggyback, not EMS.

the s54 needs to go. with that kind of goal, you really NEED the extra gear the E153 provides.
and make it LSD while your at it.
after driving both with and without it, i can definetly say its the way to go.

what are the details on the turbo?

its a 50 trim, non ball bearing.

i forgot to say that i will later add a catch can, i am still trying to decide on one i like. i want one that is baffled with a clear sight, but what is the efficiency difference between recirculating and just venting it? i also noticed in a guide i was looking at that the ones that were not baffeled were recirc. and ones that were baffeled were vented. why? excuse my ignorance.
i am leaning toward the cusco 600ml.

and i totally agree manny, the s54 gotta go! wish i had the extra $ earlier to grab an mr2 tranny

you forgot 2 of everything for your buddy down the street..

>

lol! i got ya jaws, im working on my latest invention! the duplicator! lol

little dissapointed i didnt get any input besides manny was curious what others would have on their checklist

This post has been edited by easternpiro1: Jan 15, 2009 - 12:56 AM

hehe thanks bud.. you guys are just keeping me on my toes cuz I don't want to copy either you or nick

instead of getting the mr2 e153, get the solara or camry e153 tranny. They're not hard to find.

>


or a Lexus ES

they are easy to find, but most of them are non LSD, so if you want a LSD tranny, better look for MR2 ( $ )

Except that the LSD in the MR2 tranny is designed for RWD use, not really a good idea. Get a Camry/Solara E153 and a Quaife, and be done with it

-Doc

>

WTF does that mean? The MR2 LSD tranny is a great choice, I am currently running it and havent had the slightest issue....Do you think that because the MR2 is "RWD" that it would make a difference? If that is the case then I am sorry but you are misinformed. Its a mid engine car, so it doesnt have drive shafts, the axles go directly into the Tranny just like a FWD setup.

And why would you suggest buying a NON-LSD to install an LSD into, when you can just buy an LSD to start with? That doesn't make sense. A NON-LSD will run you about 400$ plus 1200$ for the quaife diff you suggested (http://www.nolimitmotorsport.com/prod/QDF17E) plus Axles 200, plus having the cost of having the new LSD installed (if you dont do it yourself) Totaling over 1600, that does NOT included the cost of swapping out the Differential to the New LSD.

Or you can just buy an LSD tranny with axles for around 1000-1400 and be DONE with it.

>

In a FWD, it's important to use a gear-type LSD, also called a Helical Gear LSD or an ATB (automatic torque biasing) differential, because the wheels are you applying the power to are also the wheels that steer the car. In a RWD, this isn't a concern and so LSDs for RWD vehicle are usually more of a "locker" type or clutch type, which if used in a FWD car, could cause a dangerous condition in certain situations, such as corning in slippery conditions. I'm quite sure that the LSD in the MR2 transmission is of this type (since there is a visible "diff pin" in the axle hole), although I suppose I could be wrong. I've had some conversations with people using the MR2 LSD in FWD use and it giving them a lot of problems.

It's very important to understand that there are MANY different types of differentials and they all work differently, and are typically made for different uses. The Quaife LSD is specifically designed to work in FWD use as well as RWD, as a torque biasing differential it does not "lock" but smoothly transfers torque (torque biasing) from one wheel to the other, up to over 90% to whichever wheel has more traction. Using a Quaife is DEFINITELY more expensive. Doing things right the first time usually is (Plus, the Quaife has a lifetime warranty )

LOL, I'm well aware of the setup of an MR2, thank you

-Doc

*edit*

This conversation inspired me to sit down and do some research on what type the OEM LSD in the MR2 transmission is. It seems that there's no clear answer, most of the gen 2 engines have transmissions with a viscous coupling LSD, but it seems that the gen 3 engines often, but not always, come with an aftermarket clutch-type LSD. This may explain the variation in the results people are getting when using an MR2 LSD in a FWD Celica: the viscous coupling LSD will probably work just fine (although not nearly as effectively as a Quaife), whereas the clutch-type is going to give potential problems in FWD daily-driven use. With all the questions and confusion, it makes a lot of sense to spend a couple hundred bucks more to put a Quaife into a transmission already set up for FWD and be done with it. Then you KNOW that you have the best LSD you can get

-Doc

This post has been edited by Dr_Tweak: Jan 28, 2009 - 11:20 AM

well here is something to think about. the selector shaft on the MR2 is on the wrong side. it might be better to get an all-trac tranny and convert it to FWD (not hard to do) i dont know what side the Camry/solara selector shaft is on.

its a PITA to change sides of the selector shaft.

The Camry/Solara selectors are on the correct side for FWD use.

-Doc

good info.

tweak, who are these people who have had issues with the mr2 lsd?
again, im strictly talking mr2 lsd trannys in celicas.
ive never heard of any, ive been around awhile too you know

smaay switching the selector arm takes all of 5 minutes.

much easier than converting an AWD tranny.

I was hoping he would post up, I can't remember for sure and I get so many PMs that I have to empty my inbox a couple times a week LOL. GT4Wannabe maybe? It was someone who usually posts quite a bit in the technical sections....

>


He probably got a none lsd trans when he thought he paid for an lsd one.

Alright Tweak I did some searching, and couldn't find any posts from the VERY few people who are running an LSD, having "trouble" with the LSD trans. No offense, but have you ever driven a Celica with an E153, let alone a Celica with an E153 with LSD? I don't mean that in a negative manor, I just dont want to spread Misinformation on 6GC due to one bad apple. So if you have PERSONALLY had a bad experience with an Mr2 LSD transmission then I would like to hear about it. There are to many variables that would have to be looked at, to make such a statement based upon a PM through a second hand source. For example, The condition of the Trans itself, what ACTUAL Diff was in there (because if an aftermarket 2-way type LSD that was installed in there, that would account for a miserable ride for either car MR2/Celica), what other parts does this person have surrounding the trans (in example, is this person using proper mounts, shifter cables, spacers if necessary, etc), and what problems he was actually encountering.

I have OWNED and EXPERIENCED all 3 setups....S54/E153/and LSD E153. And I can tell you from EXPERIENCE that a well done, properly setup E153 swap (LSD or NON-LSD) will drive exactly the same way a Stock S54 will, but with the advantage of longer gears. There are absolutely NO differences between the S54 and the NON LSD E153 in drive-ability. The only difference when using an LSD from an MR2 is better traction . The only difference you "feel" is when trying to accelerate hard through a turn, you feel the car want to "straighten out." For a better explanation, when accelerating hard through a tight right hand turn, you FEEL the car want to actually drive to the right. And the opposite goes for when you are accelerating hard through a tight left turn, you FEEL the car want to drive more to the left. And this is as far as it goes. Its just a feeling, nothing really more than that....That is the best way to describe it, this is nothing uncomfortable, not hard to control at all, and certainly NOT dangerous.

So again, READING things over the internet through a wide array of different possibility that may not be covered....sometimes doesn't cut it. Where as having REAL LIFE EXPERIENCES with your own properly done setup can give you a more realistic opinion/knowledge of said topic. Lets not "ruin" the advantages of being able to buy an E153 with factory LSD due to some VERY UNCLEAR information. I would love for you to post up the PM/the post/or the link to where you have read this, because it goes against EVERYTHING I have READ, and EXPERIENCED so far....I would like to be able to see where the problem lies, for future reference and for my own perosnal knowledge/learning


We are severely high jacking this guys thread BTW

not to really be an ass or anything, but to me, it just sounds like somthing a guy would say when trying to upsell his services.

which i really cant blame you for, its how you make money. i just dont want this community to be misinformed because of it.

This reminds me of the times people who had no first hand experience would post that the s54 cant possibly hold the power of a stock 3sgte swap. Then they would point to some one guy who though his trans blew, when in fact he later found out it was only a clutch issue.

You cant just go by the second hand experiences of one person.

now THIS is the result i was looking for! hey jim, you guys are NOT hijacking, this is a fourm, and i am VERY appreciative of ANY discussion that will help me learn. thats the main reason why i posted the checklist, i knew someone would create a healthy debate! thanks guys!

now... as far as LSD or non LSD/E153 -VS- the S54 Ive heard that the S54 can only handle so much power (low 300's is what i was told iirc)

i know for a fact that the gearing would be a definate plus shoud i upgrade tranny's later on (which i probably will) BUT what about an LSD installed in an S54? has anyone run that on here? ive been told it can be done, but of course in my case it probably would be better to just get the 153.

sure, you can have LSD installed in the s54..and im sure it would make a diffrence, but then you'd still have failboat gearing for the amount of power you have. lol

>

Waste of money. For the cost of the LSD and the install, you could have yourself an lsd e153.

> indeed!! lol you put it in better terms than plyr did after driving my car! lol! i forgot exactly how he said it though, i just remember the pain in the ass part.


>

this is true, just curious if anyone here has done it?

>

No personal experience. If you read my post, you'd note that I said that it may have had an aftermarket 2-way LSD in it since apparently a lot of the 3rd gen 3SGTEs came with them for whatever reason (information based, again, reading on the internet so it may be completely wrong).

>

Sure is starting to feel like I'm not welcome around here anymore.

tweak, like i said, i dont fault you for trying to make money, its called buisness for a reason, i just dont want the community misinformed because of it.

sorry if i made ya feel not welcome, cause that is not the intention.

>

It makes me sad that you would think I that would intentionally misinform my customers and a community I've been a part of for so long, just to make a buck. I want people to have the best possible results from the money they are putting into their cars. That's about it.

-Doc

This post has been edited by Dr_Tweak: Feb 2, 2009 - 2:38 PM

>

Most (meaning almost all) GEN3's that came with LSD have a viscous coupling LSD. So the chances of getting an LSD from a GEN3 with anything BUT a viscous coupling LSD will be far and few between. And as stated a few times now, this is an Ideal trans for a FWD setup. Now there is a chance when buying a GEN3 LSD (as with buying any used LSD with vague to little information) that you may get an LSD trans with a TRD 1.5 clutch type LSD (dealer option) or a 2-way that was installed by the previous owner.

Just like buying anything else, if there is good reliable information about the trans, and the person can verify that it is in fact a viscous coupling LSD, you are good to go. But if you go out on a limb and buy a GEN3 LSD trans from an importer with no REAL information on it, well then you take the gamble of POSSIBLY getting an LSD trans with something in it other than a viscous coupling LSD.