OK! I know it's not a forum friendly discussion but it's really common on other cars (rwd mostly)
you see sr rb 2jz and ls , bmw and mercedes v8 and v10s powered cars a lot these days.
Of course you can make that power of a 3s but it's not the best motor around.
Which swap would you do if you wanted big hp numbers and reliability for an AWD st205?
I've seen some v6 but they are fwd , and also a 4g (evo) swapped here in Greece.

I would like to hear some opinions and not the typical "stick with your 3s".

Here... Buy this :
http://forums.modified.com/70/1039095/buy-...ngine-assembly/

Also you're from Greece so you should be aware of this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=npJB2rz2MZA



Otherwise sure... **** it... dump $100k into the car and just go out and get a BMW S70 V12

This post has been edited by cardshark525: Jun 16, 2014 - 6:29 PM

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Thank you for your kind comments.
and just because I am from Greece and I know Dimitris drag celica for some years now and his opinion for the 3s motor I would like to hear some more serious thoughts about what other swaps have been done or could have been.
Come on ! This is not a honda forum. You can be more polite.

Maybe you've seen the K20 swapped MR2? Yes it's rwd but I'd imagine the adapter plate would work the same for the E154F. Only problem I might see is the rear of the engine interfering with the transfer case..idk, just speculation.. http://www.huxracing.com/#!cannibal1/cco3

Thought about a drive train from an STi? haha The EJ isn't the *most* reliable for big power..but I'd much rather pull one of those out than my 3s..

I think the biggest problem you will run into (and why people go rwd) is finding an engine that will line up to the E154F (if you wanted to keep that trans, idk).

Or do a drive train swap from an IS-F. Do it..

This post has been edited by Malek: Jun 17, 2014 - 2:31 PM

plain and simple, you can put any engine you want. Most people here, dont talk about it because it cost money. If you have it, and like a challenge go for it.

there is a guy here doing a RWD conversion with a 3sgte engine. not that easy tough, but with money, and time and skills you can do it.

This is not your average, high skill, high coin, DIY fabricator forum. There are a few exceptions. Some of these guys are good.

But most wont think over the box, because the cost is high. a 3sgte is around 4000 usd, and thats with no body mods, so you can imagine. The MR2 guys are swapping 2gr and their cost is 7000 +++, so if you want a real RWD celica, the cost is going to be higher... lol

but the best engine to start a rwd will be a 2jz, but for the money you will invest, better buy a beat up supra and repair it. A black top beams is only 200 hp, same as redtop. So you see practicality comes into play, unless you must have a rwd celica to drag race it, i can guarantee you, no one will answer here, and this post will be locked...

Not the most hp out there, but a 1UZ is a good option for a RWD setup.

yup forgot that, but space will be tight... but yeah.. after seeing project Binky. (a 3sgte with awd mini). you can put anything in a car provided you have, skills, time and moolah

Well, there's the MZ family of V6 engines. Ehhh... Maybe the GR family could work out as well. Ehh, not much else in the S family you're really want. Anything else will mean some pretty extensive fabrication.

1mz block 3mz heads
Forged internals
Add boost till happy

If you stay awd that is

This post has been edited by kurt95gt: Jun 17, 2014 - 8:02 PM

OMGZ KURT IS ALIVE.

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Other way around. 3MZ block with 1MZ heads. you would need serious mods to the 3MZ heads to put them on a 1MZ block.

I totally would be up for a twin turbo 3MZ/1MZ hybrid ST205.

that would be insane!
problem is that these v6 are really hard to find here in Greece and even less mechanincs would put their hands on them
The K20 is a great motor as mentioned and since it's been swaped on mr2's that could be easier.
the f20 is a similar motor with potential and a couple 6-700hp s2000s are curently selling for 10.000 (that's less than buying the parts only)
Same and better prices goes with some vw audi seats. the 20vt engine is a common engine tha goes safly on the 500 mark. and most of these germans are dailys.

Can take the 3S-GTE into the 600's last I knew of. If it were me I'd just work with what's there unless the engine needed replaced anyway.

2GR-FE, 3.5L V6, over 270 hp stock. If that wasnt enough you could try putting a 1GR crankshaft into it, that way it would be 4 liters. Bolt on supercharger makes it over 350hp.

Imagine what a little bit of boost and a standalone ecu could do on this engine, and it should bolt right up to your E154 bellhousing.

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does the 2GR really bolts right up to the st205 awd tranny?
Is there somone that did it?

I dont think they have ever been mated, but the bellhousing bolt pattern is the same. They have been mated to E153s, so the only potential problem you would face is whether the transfer case would hit the block.
People who have mated a 1mz to an e154 said they had to grind some material off the block to get them to fit together, but there were also special castings of 1mzs that came with an awd gearbox (maybe an awd rx300?). There may be awd variants of the 2gr as well, noone really knows a lot about them since they are so new and expensive.

For something different and fun...335i twin turbo I6, or E92 M3 V8.

This post has been edited by SwissFerdi: Jun 19, 2014 - 3:52 PM

custom build an engine out of 2 CBR1000 engines and add boost for a 12000 rpm boost monster.

this thread is useless and will be closed any second now

This post has been edited by BonzaiCelica: Jun 20, 2014 - 1:53 PM

It's not entirely useless, and there's no one ripping out anyone else's throats so I don't see it being closed. The 1MZ/3MZ and 2GR are feasible. Also I came back to add an entirely plausible option; Get a 5S block and strengthen the internals for a 2.2L 3S-GTE.

Since there are more than one cars with that kind of swaps I dont't find it useless.
It's a conversation that may help some people built a better car. like kurts v6 celica and other 5s celicas.
I have seen a local old lexus running a 1uz v8 with 0.4 of boost with stock internals.
The owner used it as a drift car and won several races on the local championship against fully built monsters and the 1uz was completely stock. Just a turbo kit attached on it.
He said that the 1uz has semiforged internals that can handle boost till 1bar!!! I'm not sure about that but the car was on track for several years till the regulations changed and he built another car accordingly to new regulations.
He was abusing and racing that engine like there's no tomorow. the engine had put 420whp/5800, 650nm/3500. (0.42 bar)

Back at the point.
It would be interesting to put a turbo v8 on the celica.
The cost would be
-a complete 1-uz swap for 1500 to 2000 euro.
-custom mounts for the engine and transmission or an adaptor for the E154 around 1000 e
-a custom turbo kit around 2000 maybe 3000 e
-an aftermarket ecu (emanage ultimate maybe) for 500 e
-some other stuff like a boost controller, some gauges and couple other that I may forget 500-1000 e
-the work that needs to be done from a mechanic - electrician - tuner 1000 or maybe 2000 e
so approximately 7 - 10.000 euros

you can achieve that hp number with the 3s. I know. but the v8 would be more fun to drive and has more potential.
That's a completely stock motor with just 0.4 of boost. civilised - daily - reliable.
If you add some forged internals and bigger turbo set up ......

The problem is making certain engines fit though.

There is it.
A ta22 with a turbo v8 1uz and awd !

here is the link celica v8 awd

1uz wont fit with any traverse awd layout on the 6gc. The oil pan would hit the ground without a dry sump system and the front of the block (without any pulleys or accessories) would be 6 inches past the inside frame rail, meaning after cutting the front of the car apart to make it fit your passengerside tire would rub the block when making left turns.

You could potentially start cutting up the car and weld a longitudinally mounted 1uz in, with a 4x4 transfer case and a solid front axle. I dont think IFS would be possible, you need an axle with a differential and the differential has to be offset to match the driveshaft from the transfer case. Lastly you will need a custom rack and pinion or worm gear steering setup and a fully custom front suspension.

If you want a 4liter, awd celica, the only practical way its gonna happen is swapping an 2grfe in with a 1gr crankshaft. It would eat 1uz's for breakfast.

An V8 awd celica is impossible, a 4wd celica is possible but not at all feasible. Easiest way would be to weld the celica body onto an existing 4x4 chassis

This post has been edited by Special_Edy: Jun 21, 2014 - 7:20 PM

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That's what I meant. Brain fart sorry.
I would love to see a and v6 6gen turbo or not

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Thanks Special Edy!
A quick search showed that the 2grfe is a more common platform and can make some serious power.
Accordingly to you and what I understand, the 2gr-fe produces 266-280 hp as a 3.5l engine.
If the 1gr rankshaft is interchangeable then the extra half liter will push the power to more than 300 na hp and some tons of torque. all these are measured with just 87 octane fuel!!!
Plus the awd capabilty and comparative low weight due to the aluminium block.
So, lets say

scenario 1 : a light turbo set up
How much boost could the stock motor - fuel system - ecu - etc could handle and support?
What power should be expected from this?

Senario 2 : a built engine to support more boost without excessive modifications but retain drivability characteristics.
factory forged rods ( If I'm not wrong )
a set of forged pistons,
arp studs
a set of cometic gasket
upgrated(?) fuel system
a piggy back ecu? (is there something that support 6 cylinder engines? or a stand alone unit is nessecary?)
a stronger clutch
and what short of power do you think should be expected from such a set up?

It's a hard motor to source tho. What would be the most common cars that came with?


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Me too.
This thread was not meant to offend the 3s potential.
I just want to make something different and maybe better.
v6 and v8 motors are awesome!!!

Could you give some more information about the 3mz block - 1mz head combination?
Is it easy to retain the awd? Maybe Any non 6gc that use it and boost that motor?

and just show some understanding for my bad English (maybe)
I do my best.

A company called DTM(I think) built a Camry running a 3mz/1mz combo. Built an boosted it made 1057 HP /629 to
Now given that's not your normal build but it does show what can be done. Pretty sure that's on a stock block with upgraded internals

Smash did a hybrid. He can tell you more about it than I could