okay....so ive been thinking alot...and i really want to get Jl audio subs.

i want to get W7.

now im either gonan get

three 10's
or
two 12's

they will be w7's

and i have yet to decide what amp to get.

my only question is how hard will three 10's actully pound?

i want to be able to atleast pound a little....like so you cna hear me coming from a lil bit away.

i know the 12's will be much louder and pound more, but i really want to get that tight clean punchy bass


so any feedback would be great!

my buddy has 3 10' w0's on a 500/1 and they werent as loud as my type r's... w7 is a whole diff story tho... if u got the $$$ then get 2 of those with a jl 1000/1 amp and ull lose hearing, since thats what it seems like u want 12 or 10, the w7 will pound regardless... money is the biggest factor with jl

okay, 10 inch subs.... if you're going to spend the money on a W7, get 12 inch, the sound is crystal clear and they hit HARD, however, if you play a lot of metal... you're not going to get the full effect due to quick double bass hits and whatnot... if you want a loud quick 10 inch... don't waste your money on a W7, too overpriced for what you're looking for... the 10 inch W7 is built for sound... not THUMP... take a look at a cerwin vega 10" stroker, i think its exactly what you're looking for, not too mention sound way better than any JL anyday....(cerwin vega in general)... the only real question is do you have the budget for the amps to power these monsters? they are RMS 2000watts...\


EDIT: i had two of these in my car before i wrecked it and i couldn't sit in the car and turn the music up all the way...

This post has been edited by pittfirefighter: Mar 11, 2007 - 6:58 PM

so.....im getting two totally diffrent opinions here.......


i really think i want two 10's right now

with this box
http://gforceperformanceaudio.com/
(the one for 2 10's)

and i wouldnt be able to afford a jl amp....to pricey, but i was thinkin a Hifonics amp http://www.onlinecarstereo.com/CarAudio/Pr...ProductID=16370

tahts what im thinking right now.....but right now the biggest concern would be is if the 2 10 W7's will "pound" i know they will sound amazing, but i also want to be able to pound that **** too! haha

ohhh and would anyone happen to kno the exact dimensions for the COUPE trunk?? jsut wondering.....

no offense but ur very indecisive with ur system choices... JL w7's will still pound, regardless of their great sound quality... what you put in ($$$) is what you get out... when ur moving up to this level of power coming from amps, ull need to upgrade other electrical componenets, or u will be getting very upset when your alt goes out, or when some other electrical problem happens... look into a cap, new battery, and possibly a new alt, because that hifonics amp is a beast and will be drawing much more power than u can give it... these electrical problems/upgrades were why i settled for my 1200 and why i still have it... hopefully something out of all of that is useful though, ill keep trying to help u along, plus keep in mind, im no pro, im just speaking on my learnings when i was just like you going through a lot of diff equipment and not knowing what to get

ok if you want to push more than 600 watts, you'll need a cap too, more than 1000, new battery and new alt is never a bad idea, and you last post brings up a very good point i forgot to mention that many people don't know... the amplifier IS THE MOST IMPORTANT PART OF THE SYSTEM... a good amplifier with bad subs will sound bad, however, a sub-par amplifier will make the best subs sound like trash and can RUIN your subs, distortion blows subs and the greatest factor of distortion is the amp, invest your money in a good amp before good subs... if you want a good system, good response, good amplification, good thump, and a good price, look into elemental design subs and amps... www.edesignaudio.com, their edead is also world renown.....

well the 10 W7's run at 500 rms and has a peak of 1000

i want 2 10's

so i really only need a amp w/ like 2000 something watts
and is it possible to use a "mono" amp for 2 subs?

and waht amp would you reccomend?....i cnat spend a million dollars on a amp, so wahts a decent amp for these subs?

and how does it work...when you get the subs their own battery and place it in the trunk? do you jsut wire the subs to hte battery? hows that work?


but i deff want the 2 10's....as of right now

With the W7's in 10s you're gonna do just fine. Since they run 500 RMS then you're gonna want a mono amp class D and just run the wiring for them both together.
As for hooking them up, you just get an amp wiring kit and run it off the positive of the battery under your hood. If you're worried about your power then get a capacitor to store the extra power you'll be using so that your lights don't dim every time the bass hits. lol.

>

DO NOT DO THIS!! haha this is why you pay a shop to install systems.... physics is very important


ok let me try and walk you through this.... the W7's cannot be wired to ONE amp... you need TWO.... unless we step back and redo all of the electrical components like we said before...

the w7's are 3 ohm subs <-- yeah i know, so dumb, nothing is rated at 3 ohms

these cannot be wired in parallel because it will drop your resistance to 1.5 and i have yet to find a cheaper amp that can handle anything below 2 sufficiently, either the distortion is ridiculous (blow your subs) or they draw so much power at 1.5 that even a cap won't do, you'll have to redo electrical (kenwoods are notorious for this, even at 2 ohms)
Series is also not going to work cause i do not know of any sensible amps that put out over 1000 watts at 6 ohms... so either buy two amps, one for each sub or find a new sub....

Wow good insight! I didn't even think about that, but conveniently JL Audio's monoblock amps run 1.5-4 ohm impedance. So as long as you get one of their Slash-series amps I would think you would be ok. I can imagine they charge you a pretty penny for them though lol.
What kind of world are we coming to with hardware DRMs?

http://mobile.jlaudio.com/products_amps.php?amp_id=221

This post has been edited by GTS13: Mar 14, 2007 - 5:08 PM

yes that $700+ amp would work if you revamped the entire electrical system, at 1.5 ohms, the amp is going to try to pull an enormous amount of power from the car... you will need at least a 2 farad cap and deep cycle battery like optima yellow top, you might be alright with it as a single battery alone but you're going to have a rougher engine start, so i would run it as a second battery

So the ultimate consensus is that: Dude you're aiming for the wrong woofer lol. I have two Infinity Kappa Perfect 10.1s waiting for install, I need to buy the rest of my equipment, you'd probably be way better off getting something like those.

oaky wow.

alright so looks like JL is out of the question.

ummmm

im feeling kicker L7

any thoughts?

okay......

two 10' Kicker L7's

now waht you guys think?

they will most likely be powered by a hifonics 1200 rms amp w/ a peak power of 2400 watss...(supposedly )

for the record, you'll never reach PEAK, on any subwoofer. (with I normal SANE budget)

HAHA, ok so you're going from JL W 7's which are some of the best subs on the market but for certain applications... like one W7, with the right amp is absolutely amazing.... to kicker's.... hmmmm kicker, probably one of the most hyped names in subwoofers that does not deserve it... behind kenwood and pioneer but thats just because people buy stuff from Best Buy , i've been hearing a lot of hype about hifonics amps... still have not put them in a customer's ride but haven't heard too much negative about them yet... from a user, from an installer, from someone who loves music...
LOOK INTO THESE, SUBS AND AMPS ARE BOTH AMAZING, THERE IS NO MIDDLE MAN... they don't sell to retailers so what you pay for... is what you get....

www.edesignaudio.com
this is always the first company i suggest to any customer... check them out... 11ov2 should be just what you need, get the dual 2ohm version (2 of them) and the nine.1, run the coils in series and the subs parallel, gives you 450 watts at 12.5 volts to each sub at 2 ohms on amp.... PERFECTO... and you can combine them in a package and save $100+ and even more if you buy a box from them...
they will HIT HARD, they will sound amazing and you will be happy

There's a lot of misconceptions flying around this thread.

That eD suggestion is, by far, the best and most complete thought in this thread.

>
Good job stating the obvious, but please if you say there are a lot of misconceptions, then correct them, and maybe add a "complete thought" of your own.

okay....so you guys reccomend 2 10's of the elementals?
w/ the mono amp?

http://www.edesignaudio.com/edv2/product_i...;products_id=34

http://www.edesignaudio.com/edv2/product_i...;products_id=44

http://www.edesignaudio.com/edv2/product_i...products_id=119


right? my only question.....is what freking size are those woofers? it dosent say anywhere?

and will that amp give enough power for 2 of those subs???

and you guys are positive these thigns hit hard and sound good??

and uhmm reccomend any wiring kits? or wires etc etc...?? at this point i might as well get all ED stuff......so like power wire, speaker wire, stuff like that.....like wire sizes and stuff...?

This post has been edited by KB-2: Mar 16, 2007 - 10:57 AM

>



Well, I did add a complete thought, I like the eD suggestion. It's easy, it should do what KB-2 is looking for, and based on the implication that we are looking for something easy, it's a "set", a one shot-deal so to speak, at a reasonable price. Oh, and eD tech support is excellent. We don't have him running around trying to match impedance, wattage, efficiency, we're not mentioning crossover points and airspace and whatnot.



If we want to get more complex, I'd start with the generalization that a mediocre sub and amp will sound good in a proper enclosure. If you want to be heard "from a lil bit away", then face the subs towards the back of the car. Even two decent 10's in this configuration with a moderate amount of power should move enough air and cause enough vibrations to meet or exceed what KB-2 is looking for.



Since there was no actual mention of sound quality, we won't discuss it at this time.



Now, to keep you happy, let's find one or two of those misconceptions.



A cap is a solution to a specific problem...it's been a while and I can't recall the technical name at this time, but it is essentially when the alternator can't provide current quickly enough, and you have a momentary dip in voltage. Many people randomly say to "put a cap in", which is attempting to solve a problem that may not even exist.



While we're at it, let's move to the battery. A bigger battery isn't the solution to a high current draw unless you like (or need) to play the system and draw that current while the car is off.



Before all these measures to problems that may or may not exist are implemented, it may be better to focus on the setup - a reasonable one that won't draw too much current in the first place. Get that installed, then determine if there is a problem, and if so how to fix it.

>

The JL subs works with every kind of music (i got a pair of old School W3) and i could say you that they are the winners.... if you want get a good SQ i'll recommend you JL subs.... they're kid of expensives but you're getting a great quality, so... the W7 need a lot of power...


How much do you want to spend???


One Monoblock amp that ' could recommend you is between, the JL monoblock 1500/1 for both subs
The kicker ZX 1300.1
or Two crossfire VR1000D

The wiring kit sould be good, cause you need the mos quantity of energy, then if you'll install those subs.. i'll recommend you a 2gauge positive cable, 16 gauge cable for the speakers, Stinger RCA cables or tsunami, there are so many brands of Audio cables....

what else do you want to install????

>



Specs tab. If you are looking for the outside diameter:

>>>>Outside Diameter: 10.250" >>>>



>



The "more power information" link shows that each sub will be quite happy somewhere between 200w and about 600w. You have several wiring options between going with a 2 Ohm DVC or a 4 Ohm DVC sub, but you should easily get your power into that range. My suggestion would be to contact eD directly and see what their recommendation is.



>



What wiring and equipment is already in the car?

http://www.edesignaudio.com/edv2/product_i...ts_id=130\

Get this wiring kit, it's all tsunami wires, this will work just fine

As for subs and amps, just get what i said before, yes one nine.1 will be just fine, it can power both subs at 2ohms, just make sure you get the dual 2 ohm version of the sub

Only part of the system i'm not sure about is the box you found... it will sound good and the vented will hit harder than non-vented but just check out the size specs, it should fit in the celica but i don't have a celica or tape measure on had

ok time to clarify a few things since everyone seems to be learning a great deal from this post...


>
A capacitor should be put in anytime the voltage draw per sub exceeds 600 watts, it easily draws enough power at this amount to damage both your battery and alternator... which brings me to my next point....

>
WRONG! The battery has everything to do with the car being ON and off. When your lights dim from a hard hit, the current comes from the battery not the alternator, the alternator then tries to replace this current which it usually can't do fast enough which is why your lights dim, NOW... there was no mention of a BIGGER battery... there was however mention of an optima yellow top deep cycle battery... DEEP CYCLE... it means its an actual battery compared to stock batteries... which are more like caps... quick discharge and then no power until recharged

but back to the relevance of this information on this post...
A. these two were talked about when drawing 2000watts with the JL subs
B. at two ohms... you might need a capacitor in the celica... and i'm saying this for one reason only... if you push your brakes at night... your lights dim its only a 70 amp alternator.... but one good point from that ridiculous post earlier... get the system first, and then see if you need the cap

you should have all the links now to all the equipment you need.... remember DUAL 2OHM, and check those box specs to see if it will fit

>



Yeah? That's a pretty specific number. Care to explain where it came from? Please also clarify where this fluctuation in "voltage draw" is coming from.



>



Ummm...no. The battery is to start the car and provide power when the car is off. When running, the alternator switches between charging the battery and operating the accessories in your car. Sure, if you want to run high current draws with the engine off, then you need another battery - and be sure to isolate it so that it doesn't kill your starting battery.



If your car cannot provide sufficient current, then the voltage drops. That's why your lights dim. If the lights dim continually while the system is playing, you need more current. That means a bigger alternator or upgraded charging system, not a battery.

so you're telling me the alternator switches? it decides to play for the other team? put a voltage meter on it... the battery is 12.5volts standing, 14+ charging... the current comes from the battery, not the alternator, alternator charges that's all, yeah 600 watts is the general rule of thumb for us who do this professionally, now theres always factors to consider but thats the general rule...

>



When the accessories do not require full power from the alternator, then part of its output is used to charge the battery. So yes, it "switches".



If you are implying that the current to operate your accessories comes from your battery when the car is running, then I have an experiment for you. With your car running, unhook your battery. Do your power windows still work? Does your radio?



So you are saying that 600 watts instantly requires a cap? Is that RMS or peak? Is this 600 watts based on a class A/B amp, a class D amp, or maybe a true class A? You specified something about the requirement being based on voltage before. What if I have an amp that draws 100 amps of current?



This post has been edited by applejax: Mar 16, 2007 - 3:17 PM

OMG this is precious...

600 watts is RMS and thats if you actually have it wired to pull 600 watts, peak is only a number given to the the lowest "stable" resistance on the amp... now i say "stable" cause this number is derived from a split second test on the amp at extremely low frequency at low resistance, peak is never practical as you are using the amp for more than a split second unless you're in an actual SPL comp. that goes for any class cause they all draw the same voltage, amperage, and power, class has to due with circuitry and the ability to run stable at different resistance

AS for a 100AMP amplifier, you would have to be pushing between 10000 (yes ten thousand) and 160000 (one hundred and sixty thousand) watts of power to the subs, ummm you might need a cap :-p

as for your little experiment, all you proved is that the alt can provide electricity, wow i think we knew that... but here's a test for ya smart guy... take a voltage meter, put it across the terminals of the battery and put a decent sized amp on the car with the car running, like a 1300 watt kenwood... run it at two ohms (class D, should run at 1 ohm, they never do though and everyone knows that)... after a few bass hits on an impala alternator... yes 102amp alternator... the battery voltage reads 11.2 and dropping... wait i thought the battery didn't matter when the car is on? even a 102amp alternator couldn't handle 1300 watts to the subs... OH wait, an optima yellow top fixed the problem... chalk one up for deep cycle batteries

as for this whole ridiculous debate on the charging of the alternator, the battery and alternator are in parallel anyways so it doesn't even matter, but what does matter is that the battery has everything to do with the car on and off, i like to see you try to prove a point that doesn't exist, the truth is that the battery is at a lower potential than the alternator so the alternator is always charging the battery AND the battery and alternator are equal in providing power... theres a lot of info in this post...

anyways... KB.. did you figure out your audio setup?

okay guys...uhh relax?

i think im gonan go w/ what you were saying: the 11 Ov2? subs by elemental designs, and then the nine.1 amp, w/ the custom box made by ED aswell. the box will fit no prob im pretty sure, i know height and depth are no prob, i jsut need to measure the width.. its a bit harder w/ a coupe. lol


but i think im gonna go w/ the two 10's, and hope that, it will be able to "bump" pretty well, i want some clean bass, but i also like to bummp alot....so tahts my only concern right now, becasue ive never heard these subs in person......right now i ahve one 15' type R and it BUMPS, but its a lil excessive i think....but thats my only real thought right now....is the "Bumpage factor"