reko

#1

On a quarter mile at race track X

A ST204 swapped with a 3SGTE 3rd gen + LSD tranny from MR2 (lighter but FWD with LSD)

VS

A ST205 with a 3SGTE 3rd gen (heavier but AWD)

who would normally win? and dont tell me ''well it depends on the driver and blablablablabla''.

I'm talking about perfect conditions, who would smoke who?

99GT

#2

ST205 owns due to traction.

808celica

#3

yeah i dont even have to think. unless its a bone stock 205 and like a 800hp swapped 205 gets off the line really really fast......swapped just catches up later.....if and only if........he can launch without spinning and the line for too long....but then again im just dreaming

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I don't normally drive fast, but when I do its on a curvy section of this island

ETNRIDER

#4

>

QUOTE (99GT @ May 29, 2008 - 12:25 PM)

>ST205 owns due to traction.

X2

Traction is more important that a lot of people think.

This post has been edited by ETNRIDER: May 29, 2008 - 12:34 PM

lagos

#5

St205 would be faster in the 1/4 because of awd.
St204 would be faster on the street "from a roll" because of less drive train loss.

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15PSI - 30MPG - Megasquirt Tuned

ETNRIDER

#6

>

QUOTE (lagos @ May 29, 2008 - 12:43 PM)

>St205 would be faster in the 1/4 because of awd.
St204 would be faster on the street "from a roll" because of less drive train loss.

Really? I wouldn't have guessed that, but I don't really know that much about all the details!!

Batman722

#7

I disagree.

Jeff with a 185 in his ran a 13.9 at the track
I have seen posts with st205s overseas that run 14s

a swapped to st205 FWD will beat an AWD st205 any day of the week on the 1/4 mile.

edit:post to back me up http://www.6gc.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=30188

This post has been edited by Batman722: May 29, 2008 - 1:57 PM

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my st205 swapandour Beams swap

x_itchy_b_x

#8

>

QUOTE (Batman722 @ May 29, 2008 - 2:47 PM)

>I disagree.

Jeff with a 185 in his ran a 13.9 at the track
I have seen posts with st205s overseas that run 14s

a swapped to st205 FWD will beat an AWD st205 any day of the week on the 1/4 mile.

edit:post to back me up http://www.6gc.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=30188

agreed. weight is a factor. the awd will have you for... like the first 60 feet then youll slowly creep by.

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Visit My Automotive & Tech Blog.

ETNRIDER

#9

Anyone got any vids of a race like this? I doubt it but you never know.

I see Batman722 link now.

This post has been edited by ETNRIDER: May 29, 2008 - 2:12 PM

Defgeph

#10

BPU swapped FWD would win against a BPU ST205. Weight and drive train loss would be the two major factors in this race.

But this is only at the BPU stage. Once you go past 275-300HP, 205 takes the cake.

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I will return one day.

lagos

#11

>

QUOTE (Batman722 @ May 29, 2008 - 2:47 PM)

>I disagree.

Jeff with a 185 in his ran a 13.9 at the track
I have seen posts with st205s overseas that run 14s

a swapped to st205 FWD will beat an AWD st205 any day of the week on the 1/4 mile.

edit:post to back me up http://www.6gc.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=30188

I guess its open to debate. imho AWD generally should run a better time because of the insanely low 60foot times it can achieve vs a fwd car. Thats why you often see stock subarus get impressive times 1/4mile times, yet loose to slower fwd cars on the street. Traction rules the 1/4mile.

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15PSI - 30MPG - Megasquirt Tuned

D-Man

#12

but it's still heavier. The AWD gets better traction, true, but the FWD has less weight.

I say we get the 2 on the track and watch

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QUOTE (presure2 @ Nov 6, 2010 - 6:16 AM)Via FB: fcuking awsome!!! D-man FTW!QUOTE (DEATH @ Nov 11, 2008 - 5:40 PM)Damn D-Man - most impressive.QUOTE (99GT @ Nov 14, 2008 - 4:04 PM)D-Man's post should be a stickyQUOTE (samir0189 @ Nov 4, 2008 - 10:50 AM)LOL, oh boy, you can always count on D-Man for ridiculously hilarious posts.

lagos

#13

>

QUOTE (D-Man @ May 29, 2008 - 3:29 PM)

>but it's still heavier. The AWD gets better traction, true, but the FWD has less weight.

I say we get the 2 on the track and watch

I guess in the celica world, this might hold true. I mean, look at the piss slow st185. Then again, I dont think most celica guys are good track drivers.

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15PSI - 30MPG - Megasquirt Tuned

ETNRIDER

#14

>

QUOTE (D-Man @ May 29, 2008 - 3:29 PM)

>but it's still heavier. The AWD gets better traction, true, but the FWD has less weight.

I say we get the 2 on the track and watch

I would love to see that!!!!

95celgt

#15

The 6th gen celica acually launches like a bat outta hell for a FWD.....when i took it to the track it would always leave other FWD's behind at the 60foot...
I even have video proof against the SS S/C Integras would fall behind and even some GT mustangs...I miss my 3S

delusionz

#16

what the real question is ... is 400 metres really enough to catch a gt-four? a car length behind is more than nothing when you're 2000 rpm behind and struggling to gain traction

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Mike W1996 Toyota Celica ST205 GT-FOURGT2860RS turbine, TiAL mvr44, JE 86.5φ piston, Clutchmasters FX400, APEX P-FC269awhp / 273ft-lbs

j0e_p3t

#17

both stock and the fwd with lsd under "perfect" conditions... i think it'd be pretty damn close. but once you start adding more power, awd would definitely own.

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ss-iii splitters and 404 skirts areon. which means i need to update my sig.

3SGTE

#18

Im already loading my gt4 st205 awd on a carrier and ill be over to the USA to settle this once and for all.... who's up for the challenge????? First though i gotta do the shopping and tidy the house!!!

Insanity-74

#19

>

QUOTE (Batman722 @ May 29, 2008 - 7:47 PM)

>I disagree.

Jeff with a 185 in his ran a 13.9 at the track
I have seen posts with st205s overseas that run 14s

a swapped to st205 FWD will beat an AWD st205 any day of the week on the 1/4 mile.

edit:post to back me up http://www.6gc.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=30188

As much as it hurts to say this, I would have to agree up to a point....both running stock or near stock power then the FWD swap would win...weight means an awfull lot when it comes to quater mile drags....but once you get past say 300/350BHP then the AWD would be able to put the power down better so would be the winner.

Cuts_the_Pilot

#20

stock for stock, or mod for mod 205 will win.
im not just biased, traction owns all.
as proof ive beaten 300kw rx7s at the drags because simply of launch.
and an rx7 gets more grip then any street fwd.

ive also beaten other carsa such as skylines and commodore utes and such. So its no fluke.
track has heaps more grip then street.
that is all.

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ST205 Group A Rallye GT-Four, #61 of 77............600hp GT3582rGRX133 Toyota Mark X 350s

D-Man

#21

>

QUOTE (3SGTE @ May 30, 2008 - 2:50 AM)

>Im already loading my gt4 st205 awd on a carrier and ill be over to the USA to settle this once and for all.... who's up for the challenge????? First though i gotta do the shopping and tidy the house!!!

talk to member DEATH, he's got a 3s swap and still on FWD. I'd love to watch But ya gotta come to Houston where the heat is like an African dessert. Give me a few months and you can run (and spank )a 5sfte too.

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QUOTE (presure2 @ Nov 6, 2010 - 6:16 AM)Via FB: fcuking awsome!!! D-man FTW!QUOTE (DEATH @ Nov 11, 2008 - 5:40 PM)Damn D-Man - most impressive.QUOTE (99GT @ Nov 14, 2008 - 4:04 PM)D-Man's post should be a stickyQUOTE (samir0189 @ Nov 4, 2008 - 10:50 AM)LOL, oh boy, you can always count on D-Man for ridiculously hilarious posts.

creis

#22

>

QUOTE

>Track was unsuprisingly damp which made for a few traction issues, but an excellent day nonetheless.

>

QUOTE

>while I ran a best of 14.14 sec. Even managed to get the car slightly sideways on run run as it was so slippery out there!

^ quotes from the above listed thread. exsplenation for the slower track times.

I just cant agree with the swapped 204 winning, I think a compleatly stock 205 and a stock 204 with 3sgte and mr2 lsd. the 205 would win but probably close, I just cant see the 204 being able to get enough traction off the line to catch up. my 5s sucks at traction as it is with upgraded sup and toyo proxi 4 tires, double the hp and it would be quite difficult to lunch without upgraded susp, and tires. (but I have not driven a swapped 204 or a 205 for that matter so I cant say for sure just my opinion)

This post has been edited by creis: May 30, 2008 - 9:15 AM

ETNRIDER

#23

What is an estimate of the weight difference? I wouldn't think it would be over 500lbs, Would it?

x_itchy_b_x

#24

i raced a vr4 when i was a stock 2nd gen. from a dig. he has more hp more tq and more traction. i passed him before the 1/8th mile out of the 1/4. thats very close to a gt4 but with more power... so?

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Visit My Automotive & Tech Blog.

devilsden97

#25

>

QUOTE (x_itchy_b_x @ May 30, 2008 - 10:37 AM)

>i raced a vr4 when i was a stock 2nd gen. from a dig. he has more hp more tq and more traction. i passed him before the 1/8th mile out of the 1/4. thats very close to a gt4 but with more power... so?

VR4: 3760lbs

gt-4: 3298lbs (converted from KG ~1500kg)

st204: 2820lbs

edit: i suck at english

This post has been edited by devilsden97: May 30, 2008 - 11:30 AM

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KawiLove

ETNRIDER

#26

[/quote]

VR4: 3760lbs

gt-4: 3298lbs (converted from KG ~1500kg)

st204: 2820lbs

edit: i suck at english
[/quote]


So there is a ~478lbs difference in the GT-4 and the st204. Dang I weigh 300lbs, guess I will always lose in a race!!

x_itchy_b_x

#27

>

QUOTE (devilsden97 @ May 30, 2008 - 12:30 PM)

>>

QUOTE (x_itchy_b_x @ May 30, 2008 - 10:37 AM)

>i raced a vr4 when i was a stock 2nd gen. from a dig. he has more hp more tq and more traction. i passed him before the 1/8th mile out of the 1/4. thats very close to a gt4 but with more power... so?

VR4: 3760lbs

gt-4: 3298lbs (converted from KG ~1500kg)

st204: 2820lbs

edit: i suck at english

320hp > 255hp also dont forget that ;D

This post has been edited by x_itchy_b_x: May 30, 2008 - 11:53 AM

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Visit My Automotive & Tech Blog.

devilsden97

#28

>

QUOTE (x_itchy_b_x @ May 30, 2008 - 12:52 PM)

>320hp > 255hp also dont forget that ;D

i know this. not doubting your story in anyway. just listing weights.

Edit: i listed the vr4 cuz u mentioned it, and many consider it to be a "heavy" sports car. Its just a comparison for the other 2 cars

This post has been edited by devilsden97: May 30, 2008 - 11:55 AM

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KawiLove

Batman722

#29

>

QUOTE (creis @ May 30, 2008 - 10:01 AM)

>>

QUOTE

>Track was unsuprisingly damp which made for a few traction issues, but an excellent day nonetheless.

>

QUOTE

>while I ran a best of 14.14 sec. Even managed to get the car slightly sideways on run run as it was so slippery out there!

^ quotes from the above listed thread. exsplenation for the slower track times.

I just cant agree with the swapped 204 winning, I think a compleatly stock 205 and a stock 204 with 3sgte and mr2 lsd. the 205 would win but probably close, I just cant see the 204 being able to get enough traction off the line to catch up.

You guys missed the fact that a ST185, NOT a st205 swapped car, ran 13.9. Do you think he had traction issues too ? Yup.
Everyone has traction issues at the track, it's more about the driver. Same driver, both good launches, I'd have my $ on the swap.

If you had a swapped 204 with a st205 then "in theory" the time would be lower.

If you have a stock st205 vs a st204 swapped w/st205, the swapped (500lbs lighter) would be faster/quicker.
There is no doubt about it, same mods, or no mods, the swapped solely because of the weight factor would be faster.

AWD is great for cornering, in the snow, rallying, ect. but it's heavy...

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my st205 swapandour Beams swap

j0e_p3t

#30

not only does the swap fwd have a weight advantage, but it also has less power loss to the wheel as opposed to awd. i suppose a skilled driver with a swap could take the win, but i'd take the awd over fwd any day.

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ss-iii splitters and 404 skirts areon. which means i need to update my sig.