Soooooooo, I have had to send my 26 out to be rebuilt and in the process have found that the turbine wheels need to be changed. The shop that has the turbo says that they can't get the JDM ceramic wheels so they will have to use steel ones.

1) how will this affect my spool time/ Lag? (new to forced induction, understand the basics but am still a little fuzzy on the intricacies)

2) anyone know where to get the ceramic wheels?

3) any one have a JDM importers # or a 26 or 20b they can spare?

Thanks for your input and assistance all.

>u should of sent to atsracing they make ct 27 turbos

This post has been edited by brenton1919: May 3, 2011 - 12:23 AM

If I recall correctly the ct27 is a 26 housing with 20b internals correct? ats racing eh? I'll have to give them a ring. On that note has anyone had any luck with the aforementioned turbo either. The ct 27 that is?

This post has been edited by Darkchylde: May 3, 2011 - 1:12 AM

>yeah i was just up there the other day thats one badass turbo because they sure do sell them alot im thinking about sellin my cb20 to get one

This post has been edited by brenton1919: May 3, 2011 - 1:56 PM

does any one have the specs for the ct 27?

ct26 is crap nomatter what they do with it.

for starters the turbine exducer is 52mm in a ct26, its only 50mm in a ct20b (smaller is better here for spoolup)

the standard ct20b compressor inducer is 48mm, the largest one they can fit in the ct26 is a 46mm t04e wheel (up from the standard 42mm)

compared to a ct20b the best you can achieve with a ct26 is same max hp at a higher boost level, with an extra 1000rpm of low boost threshhold and laggy throttle response

This post has been edited by delusionz: May 4, 2011 - 5:38 PM

Okay from what I can tell Delusionz, you ARE definitely a fan of the ct 20b. My question for you is do you speak from personal experience or just a statistical stand point? If anyone out there has a ct 27 please chime in I would like to have a first hand account of spool time, max output an general upkeep? Other threads that I have come across have had many a person complaining about shattering wheels constantly.( if I am correct you are one of the people who said they dislike the constant replacement of the ct's Delusionz. If I am wrong please correct, no sarcasm just recalling.)

Calling Ats in a little while to get specs and make a decision, so lemme know!

This post has been edited by Darkchylde: May 3, 2011 - 10:20 AM

the cost of a CT27 is not worthy. your best bet is to find a CT20b, try to see if Jim has any in stock, you can pick them up personally and for a second gen is the best bolt on upgrade. this turbo will max out your fuel system, so the turbo has enough air flow to make the most out of your stock setup.

>

A ct27 or a ct20b can get you 300hp or more. A ct26 rebuild, trim upgrade, etc... will not make more than 240-250hp
Don't waste your money on a ct26 rebuild!!!! Either buy a ct20b or upgrade it to a ct27.

Yeah I'm the one that's blown a ct20b and a ct26/t04e hybrid and have gone with a garrett gt28rs

if i could got another ct20b cheap i would, but they are rare since its not just st205 guys that want them, its also st185 and sw20 guys

> dude they have kits with there ct27 turbo runnin 500 + hp

I don't know, Someone will try and correct me here but I was running 17psi on the ct26/t04e and it was like the ct20b at 14psi in the top end, it was like not having a turbo at all in the low end.

It barely felt like I had 230hp at the engine

>THE CT27 isn't the ct26 u keep saying ct26 the one thing the ct27 has is the ct26 hosing that its when your celica can beat one of atsracing mr2 u can talk all the crap in the world about a ct27 but i dont think that will ever happen i dont even think they have a mr2 up there runnin anything under 450 rwhp go check out these links on youtube this is matt's car from atsracing http://youtu.be/0Imf2NiB1xI.........and thats why u blow up turbos not because there crap because the ct26 is a good turbo but because u ride around on 17psi u are killing that turbo it is a stock turbo not after market it wasn't made to be beat up like that and if your car was stock with no upgrades you are making the turbo do all of the work

This post has been edited by brenton1919: May 3, 2011 - 5:37 PM

>

Stay away from the ceramic wheel, IMHO that's one of the worst things about the CT26. When they get hot they can shatter. If you're running low octane you have to retard timing at higher boost levels to prevent det and the wheel gets hotter while pushing harder. Go with the steel wheel rebuild if it's heaps cheaper than buying a new turbo, be aware that a 2nd hand turbo could be due for a rebuild too (would be more worth it with a '20b'. ST215 Caldina GTT turbo (C15?) will bolt up to a gen3 engine and isn't a bad option either.

Some background, I have a 2nd gen 3sgte, e153 trans and devils own Meth injection and a walbro 255 lb/hr fuel pump. I run 93 or higher at all times, I can get 100 and 116 for future reference I was thinking of transporting some up to the Colt State park meet. @ 10 a gallon. The only thing I don't have for a moderately larger turbo is the injectors. Also with this new turbo I will be puchasing both a Uego w/ or without fuel control and or a Safc.

>

I was under the impression that the ceramics allowed for faster spooling and reduced load. Am I incorrect in this assumption.

This post has been edited by Darkchylde: May 3, 2011 - 10:17 PM

You seem pretty well setup there, what ECU are you using?

I know of no advantage from the ceramic wheel, so i'm not sure why you're so keen on it?

I'm upgrading my turbo and will be using a Walbro and factory injectors, should get me to 300hp, then i'll look at upgrading the injectors later.

Not, keen on the ceramic per se, just trying to get the most reasonable and efficient setup for my dollar without sacrificing the smooth operation I have become accustomed to.

I have a stock gen2 ecu.

glad i stumbled onto this thread. I so happen to have a spare ct20b (4th gen) but hearing you guys talk about shattering turbines makes me not want to sell it.

from all the info ive been told, ceramic= lighter and that = quicker spool time. IIRC mine spooled at about 2300rpm it was an immediate kick in the crotch.

and i think i heard jim or death say that the steel wheel is MUCH more suited for higher boost as it wont shatter, but you would sacrifice spool time. IMHO i dont think the spool time difference is alot. maybe 300-400rpms? im assuming on this point.

So to clarify, the ceramic wheels will shatter, but under what load are people shattering them? i want to know because i plan on upping my boost to about 20psi when i want to have some fun, and keeping it stock 15psi when im cruising.
I also plan on installing the AEM FIC to go with the devils own kit i bought.

My power goal is about 330 and im satisfied. ive heard talk of a ct20b beign able to do better than this, but i dont want to push it with my stock 550 injectors

im REALLY sorry to thread jack but im seeing alot of knowledge on the ct20b in this thread and thats exactly what i need to absorb

good luck with your build darkchylde!

This post has been edited by easternpiro1: May 3, 2011 - 11:53 PM

Sure you don't want to part with that 20b brother? If it's in good condition I promise a fair price and honestly just want my car running again. This is my daily.

> sell it to him bro let him roll with us caldina boy's he wont have the engine like us but at least he will be rolling with the turbo

lol let me get her up and runnin, and rolling for a bit to be sure the one i got is good. i also have to rummage to find it!

>

when you own a gt4 or a 3s-gte car with the weight of a gt4 you'll reconsider the ct26. ct26 only feels good to you because even 200hp in a fwd na celica makes it go fast.

the ct26 blew its oil seals long before i boosted it to 17. 17psi is fine on a t04e rebuild, thats how the ats turbo makes its power you think they mess around with stock boost? they wont barely see 190hp at the wheels buddy let alone 450 or whatever you claim.

the ct20b ceramic turbine shattered at stock boost - 13psi.

i already posted what i know, 53mm t04e wheel is the biggest u should get in a ct26, even look on the ATS website they say the same thing themselves, their CT27 is exactly the same as the turbo I had, unless they also do something with the exhaust wheel but as i already pointed out, the ct26 exhaust wheel is 2mm oversized as it is, they cant go with a smaller wheel they can only replace it with a steel wheel which provides better durability, mine remained ceramic.

ceramic wheel makes for a faster spool, but is weaker and will break easier when pushing the turbo close to its limits, that's why people pay extra cash for WRC ct20b turbos, they have steel wheel.

I have a spare WRC CT20b turbo but it needs new seals, once I rebuuild it I will sell the turbo I currenty run on the car ( ct20b non wrc ) but I'm in no rush as I'm focusing on toher things on the car, if not that turbo would be yours art.

>dude u have no idea what you are talkin about they dont just switch out parts they redo the whole turbo what part dont u understand they dont use nothin from the ct26 but the hosing the ct20b and the ct27 are all most the the same the ct27 hp is maxed out stock with no upgraded wasted gate at 350hp thats just bolting it on to your stock set up with no up graded internals and a stock wasted gate now think if u have a 50mm wasted gate upgrade the internals the down pipe has nothin to do with nothing but use a brek down pipe upgrade your injectors u will see 700hp i dont know how yall do it over there but we dont just ride turbos we redo the whole engine like i said u are making the turbo do all the work if u have stock internals and I DONT HAVE A CT26 i have a CT20B caldina 3sgte st215 the whole engine not just the turbo around here we pay to play ill go to ats right now and buy one of there 2.2 stroker kits and it will be faster than your gt4 i go to ats alot i know what there cars can do ive seen them in person and if that turbo sucks so much i guess not bad because they have cars out the zoo sittin out there shop they couldn't even get me in last week to do my exhaust oh and by the way they use a 46 trim wheel not a 50 whatever u keep tryin to say OH and the ct20b shattered at 13 psi thats bull crap because my ct20b is runnin 15 psi all day and i have someone on here that can back me up with that....ask easternpiro1 hes runnin the same engine i am


This post has been edited by brenton1919: May 4, 2011 - 3:32 PM

>

what are you on about?

yes the t04e wheel comes with 2 options a 46 trim and a 50 trim, 50 trim is the one i had, it's 46mm inducer, the compressor housing is machined to accept the larger wheel. the stock ct26 compressor wheel only has a 42mm inducer. for comparison the stock ct20b has a 48mm inducer, so both the 46 and the 50 trim upgrades flow less than a ct20b.

sound like you need to go here and learn what trim and inducer and exducer means before you run your mouth.

as taken from atsracing.net

>

I wasn't aware of of any machining to the exhaust side, but the turbine wheel has a 52mm exducer, it's already oversized, it's only 50mm in the ct20b.

and you make no sense about flowing 350hp into stock pistons and fuel, as for one even the upgraded t04e wheel is slightly smaller than the standard ct20b compressor, so it's flowing less air at the same boost, and two didn't you know the st205 has 540cc injectors and is mapped to 18psi? ofcourse you didn't.

and yeah the turbo does do most all of the work on a low compression turbo engine, go take your turbo off and go for a drive and you'll see.

also your logic fails, you have a st215 swap and run 15psi and haven't had a problem yet, i have a genuine st205 and somehow your swapped celica has something to do with the condition of my former oem turbo?

This post has been edited by delusionz: May 4, 2011 - 5:42 PM

berk pipe and injectors 700hp are you kidding?

No CT will ever flow more enough for over 400hp.

400hp in itself would be on a tip top condition engine, with way over 20psi with a better anti knock fuel than pump gas (ie race gas, pure ethanol, or pump gas with water/meth injection) and even then 400hp would be a miracle, over 20psi would put any CT out of it's efficiency range.

Alright fellas, play nice. I know everyone has their preference. From the way things are sounding I will be trying to get a Ct 20b. Both of you are essentially telling me to do the same just from different sides of the fence. Thank you all for your time and consideration on this subject. I will be posting a WTB in the Buying and Selling forums, I'll keep you all posted.

i like this darkchylde guy classy guy.

and delusionz is right brenton, a CT20B will not make 700 with fuel and a berk pipe. its too small. needs MOAR air. HOWEVER you can get to 330ish on the ct20b with good fuel and a tune. just be careful. if you plan on boosting the fire out of your ct20b, get some water meth to be safe!


cheers! good discussion!

i have unhooked my turbo off of my engine and kept up with a 08 350z ........................dyno from atsracing on a stock block with 22PSI 22PSI 22PSI

ATS CT27 250-370 horsepower ON A STOCK BOLT ON SET UP ON BOLT ON SET UP ON A STOCK BOLT ON SET UP JDM STOCK LONG BLOCK SET UP STOCK STOCK DO U KNOW WHAT THE WORD STOCK MEANS


Mods on test car: JDM stock long block, Greddy Intercooler, KO 3" TKO exhaust, ATS Tuned Rom set for 550cc injectors, 550cc injectors, Walbro Fuel Pump, K&N style intake.........22 PSI.................................like i said if u can READ a built motor! with piston injectors cams 3" berk down pipe will get u over 500hp i dont think u have even seen a car with 300hp ............ATS CT27 BLOT ON KIT do u know what BLOT ON MEANS! ....3" exhaust, downpipe, aftermarket intake, and boost controller are highly recommended. Dyno results range from 300 flywheel horsepower at 16psi with primary catalytic converter in place to 330 horsepower at 17psi with 3" downpipe. Choose the dual map option (+$50) to run race gas and up to 19psi and 350 horsepower<===ct27 on a bolt kit...............have u ever built a engine when u upgrade stuff it tends idk to want to go faster wen your engine does more work than the turbo WHEN YOU HAVE A BUILT ENGINE the freaking size of the turbine doesn't matter if u didn't know all a turbo does is blow air in the engine u can blow all the air in the engine u want but if u dont have good internals upgraded INJECTORS your not going anywhere but boom the more psi is just how much air is in your engine and how fast its going threw i have cars that will put your little gt4 to shame non turbo itsnt that funny.. a ct27 turbo runs stock boost a 10 psi and to add on top of all this my friend has a ats ct27 turbo on his 3sgte pushing 400+ at 23 psi im not just runnin my mouth ive seen the turbo work in real life real time ive been to ats ive seen this turbo more times than any of u guys andu keep sayin trim trim trim trim dude ontill you are running 800hp and have a huge t4 turbo a 50 trim really doesn't matter u want a smaller trim for better spool time and less lag low compression high compression it dont matter u can make both of them go fast with out a turbo so since u have no idea what a engine does lets break down the 3sgte reallllyy reallly fast and see how it would run without a turbo ohhh wait they made a engine just like it what is it called hmmmm letttt me think a beamsssss 3sge ohhhh yeahhh that engine wow its a high compression engine yesss guess why because it doesn't have a turbo on it so i wonder how fast a 3sgte will be without a turbo on it hmm oh wait i know this one because ive done it before as fast as a beams that little turbo u have on your car guess what it only adds about 70hp maybe 60hp haha what did u really think a stock turbo ct20b ct26 adds a 150hp yeah never hmm where does all the power come from hmm i dont know maybe the engine ive never heard someone say a stock turbo puts out more horse power than the engine ITS STOCK! the turbo just helps the engine go faster thats why when u want to go faster what do u do u upgrade your internals thennnnn u up grade your turbo so it can keep up with the new horse power u just added to your engine its ohh wait lets upgrade the turbo then the engine haha u wont have a engine to upgrade because WHY! its going to go booom so if u can understand what im saying you can make your engine go faster without upgrading the turbo the turbo in this case is the help thats all im sure u can build the 3sgte engine to 500hp without a turbo easy then put a turbo on to get u up in the 700's maybe low 800s...and therefore i know u dont know what u are talking about because u said u cant take the ct20b pass 13psi when me and easternpiro are both runnin are ct20b on 15psi and he plans on taking his up past 15psi

>no he didn't read it right i said a built engine but i have heard the ct20b with some extra help can get u over 400+

This post has been edited by brenton1919: May 4, 2011 - 10:53 PM